Kjets On a Plane
Active member
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2002
- Location
- Californicated Oregone
Where do I even begin? This car, intermittently, would not always light all the warning lights when you would turn the key on.
Further, it would sometimes stall once in a great while, and refuse to crank once in a great while and has an intermittent battery drain.
For once, I've actually been present while it would do some of this instead of just hearing about it, only to come try to test it or make it do it and not really have an answer.
Ok so early on in the game, the battery cables looked like hell. I examined all the cables closely, scrubbed them (other grounds and cables as well and reinstalled). Seemed to mostly work. It also got a new battery to replace the ancient one. Drove for about a week and the key was left on for maybe 5-10 mins and it hasn't been able to be cranked and started since. At the best of times, all charging voltage good and key not ever left on, it would crank a little slow. The late model starter is original and probably tired. I have a good early one for it.
So I dug into it a little. Checked connections, verified that the battery was too drained to start any car (it was), put my test light on the starter solenoid wire from the ignition switch and observed something odd; in "off" and "accessory", no light (expected), in "on/run/II" dim test light, turn the key (with a tiny bit of force) toward "start/III" and no light again, turn the key to "start/III" firmly and BRIGHT light. Just to be sure, I checked my other 740, and it has absolutely no lighting of the test light except when firmly turned to "start/III." I've had one other 940SE same year and options wagon do this to me, but more severe where it would pass a little more current to the small starter solenoid wire in "on/run/II" and other positions that the solenoid would stick on for a bit and starter would be powered down, but bendix gear would not disengage right away. I suspect that this one is getting ready to do this. Anyone know if a 760 or 960 uses the same part # ignition switch? Is there a # on it? I'd rather throw a used one in it that someone else got bent over and paid a million dollars for that's recently replaced if 760/960 with late tilt wheel dash is the same (you'd think so). The other thing that has me is that I can't for the life of me remember how to get the lower column trim off. I've got the steering wheel and contact reel off properly and upper trim and knee bolster. Where the tilt lever pokes through the lower trim is just a round hole, screws don't seem accessible. If I tug sideways on it I see it pulling on a sheetmetal "fast on nut" on the other side over by the ignition lock cylinder. Looks like that has to come off? Looks like a huge pita to remove and stick back on...any easier way? Sort of hard to imagine building a car like that...hard to get off I get, but on the assy line, usually easily installed is common...this doesn't look easily installed with the plastic trim slipped over. I did pull the connector off the ignition switch and my dim test light problem went away...this was a pita having to carefully plug the air bag in and set it aside scared to death with the battery on.
Next, there is the tired starter, maybe as the result of the ignition switch always passing some current to the solenoid in "on/run/II"
, and it is a crappy late model starter that's original that I've changed a ton of. Still, I'm a little reluctant to change the starter until the ignition switch tests out good since I don't want to do ugly things to the "new" good condition early model starter soon to replace the wimpy late model junk.
Earlier on this journey of discovery, the warning lights wouldn't always come on bright in "on/run/II" with the engine not running. I think I've got that traced down. If you ground the exciter wire on the alt, they always do. Charging voltage at this point is ~12.6V with no accessories on whatever and it idling or revved to the moon. The belt and crank pulley have little/minimal slippage, I can roll the motor over from the alt pulley as it sits. Also, sometimes a couple idiot lights would come on dimly like it wasn't yet started. Often you'd rev it and they'd go out and the headlights would get brighter and they'd slowly dim out as it "charged" a bit. The voltage regulator/brush pack ohms out and works great in another 740, so that's not it. I'm going to swap a known working minty 92+ brand new bosch 940Turbo alt into it. Anything I should look out for given the multitude of potential electrical problems with this ride? Anyone ever have a lazy alt cause intermittent battery drain/lighting of the warning lamps and still charge, but not charge much or very well? Any potential problems with using the much higher continuous capacity later alt? Ground wire to the alt is just fine. Seems to have a bad diode. Commutator is worn, but not all the way (seen much worse that ran fine).
Any other tips? What an annoying model.
It is cozy, and it has a very straight no rust black 945 body with pretty nice gray interior, but plenty of the usual 7/9 problems (back doors don't always open, for one), its probably cheaper to keep it. Has an intake gasket leak, but very tight good compression B230FT, super tight T25 and pretty solid AW-71 (after I reinstalled the magnets in the oil pan jimbo left out and did check balls and cleaned the screen and tailshaft). Seems better to hang onto it. Shocks still work, including the nivomats it would seem. Pulled almost brand new bilstein TCs for it and some 240 rear springs to ditch the nivos when the time comes.
Climate control mostly works, a/c doesn't...no surprise there. Not sure if the "floor" vent vacuum servo is any good.
Further, it would sometimes stall once in a great while, and refuse to crank once in a great while and has an intermittent battery drain.
For once, I've actually been present while it would do some of this instead of just hearing about it, only to come try to test it or make it do it and not really have an answer.
Ok so early on in the game, the battery cables looked like hell. I examined all the cables closely, scrubbed them (other grounds and cables as well and reinstalled). Seemed to mostly work. It also got a new battery to replace the ancient one. Drove for about a week and the key was left on for maybe 5-10 mins and it hasn't been able to be cranked and started since. At the best of times, all charging voltage good and key not ever left on, it would crank a little slow. The late model starter is original and probably tired. I have a good early one for it.
So I dug into it a little. Checked connections, verified that the battery was too drained to start any car (it was), put my test light on the starter solenoid wire from the ignition switch and observed something odd; in "off" and "accessory", no light (expected), in "on/run/II" dim test light, turn the key (with a tiny bit of force) toward "start/III" and no light again, turn the key to "start/III" firmly and BRIGHT light. Just to be sure, I checked my other 740, and it has absolutely no lighting of the test light except when firmly turned to "start/III." I've had one other 940SE same year and options wagon do this to me, but more severe where it would pass a little more current to the small starter solenoid wire in "on/run/II" and other positions that the solenoid would stick on for a bit and starter would be powered down, but bendix gear would not disengage right away. I suspect that this one is getting ready to do this. Anyone know if a 760 or 960 uses the same part # ignition switch? Is there a # on it? I'd rather throw a used one in it that someone else got bent over and paid a million dollars for that's recently replaced if 760/960 with late tilt wheel dash is the same (you'd think so). The other thing that has me is that I can't for the life of me remember how to get the lower column trim off. I've got the steering wheel and contact reel off properly and upper trim and knee bolster. Where the tilt lever pokes through the lower trim is just a round hole, screws don't seem accessible. If I tug sideways on it I see it pulling on a sheetmetal "fast on nut" on the other side over by the ignition lock cylinder. Looks like that has to come off? Looks like a huge pita to remove and stick back on...any easier way? Sort of hard to imagine building a car like that...hard to get off I get, but on the assy line, usually easily installed is common...this doesn't look easily installed with the plastic trim slipped over. I did pull the connector off the ignition switch and my dim test light problem went away...this was a pita having to carefully plug the air bag in and set it aside scared to death with the battery on.
Next, there is the tired starter, maybe as the result of the ignition switch always passing some current to the solenoid in "on/run/II"
, and it is a crappy late model starter that's original that I've changed a ton of. Still, I'm a little reluctant to change the starter until the ignition switch tests out good since I don't want to do ugly things to the "new" good condition early model starter soon to replace the wimpy late model junk.
Earlier on this journey of discovery, the warning lights wouldn't always come on bright in "on/run/II" with the engine not running. I think I've got that traced down. If you ground the exciter wire on the alt, they always do. Charging voltage at this point is ~12.6V with no accessories on whatever and it idling or revved to the moon. The belt and crank pulley have little/minimal slippage, I can roll the motor over from the alt pulley as it sits. Also, sometimes a couple idiot lights would come on dimly like it wasn't yet started. Often you'd rev it and they'd go out and the headlights would get brighter and they'd slowly dim out as it "charged" a bit. The voltage regulator/brush pack ohms out and works great in another 740, so that's not it. I'm going to swap a known working minty 92+ brand new bosch 940Turbo alt into it. Anything I should look out for given the multitude of potential electrical problems with this ride? Anyone ever have a lazy alt cause intermittent battery drain/lighting of the warning lamps and still charge, but not charge much or very well? Any potential problems with using the much higher continuous capacity later alt? Ground wire to the alt is just fine. Seems to have a bad diode. Commutator is worn, but not all the way (seen much worse that ran fine).
Any other tips? What an annoying model.
It is cozy, and it has a very straight no rust black 945 body with pretty nice gray interior, but plenty of the usual 7/9 problems (back doors don't always open, for one), its probably cheaper to keep it. Has an intake gasket leak, but very tight good compression B230FT, super tight T25 and pretty solid AW-71 (after I reinstalled the magnets in the oil pan jimbo left out and did check balls and cleaned the screen and tailshaft). Seems better to hang onto it. Shocks still work, including the nivomats it would seem. Pulled almost brand new bilstein TCs for it and some 240 rear springs to ditch the nivos when the time comes.
Climate control mostly works, a/c doesn't...no surprise there. Not sure if the "floor" vent vacuum servo is any good.