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B230f+T or B230ET Pros and Cons

joethefish

New member
Joined
May 29, 2008
Location
Dorset UK
B230E +T or B230ET Pros and cons? Engine numbers added..

Hi all, some of you may have seen my wiring loom issues thread. Basically I aquired a B230ET to fit in my 240. Sadly turned out much of the loom was missing.
Anyway it now looks like I have a MS v2.2 setup coming. So my question is this.. do I:

a) Fit the B230ET (89k Full service history) and MS it.
b) Keep the B230F thats already in and running (rebuilt 50k ago) and +T it, using bits from the ET engine. (also MS it)

Ideas or pros and cons on both appreciated. I also have a M46 4+o/d box (on the B230ET) and a high mileage M47 5 speed box (on the B230f)

Thanks
Joe
 
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The ET will have the better flowing 531 head and sodium coated valves and a better cam, but will have the thin con-rods. The F will have higher compression but thicker rods and a poorer (relatively) flowing head and a poorer cam. Ideally you'd want a mix of both but that invloves a bit of rebuilding so I'd either use the ET as it is or swap the ET's head (inc cam) onto the F's bottom end if the high(er) compression ratio doesn't bother you. You will (probably) want to use the flywheel from the F as it has easier to use triggers than the ET's as the ET's used Motronic compared to the F's LH 2.4. this obviously isn't an issue if you +T the F, but worth bearing in mind if you swap blocks/engines.

Gearboxwise I'd stick with the M47 otherwise you need to get involved with sourcing a new propshaft as the M46 is longer
 
The ET will have the better flowing 531 head and sodium coated valves and a better cam, but will have the thin con-rods. The F will have higher compression but thicker rods and a poorer (relatively) flowing head and a poorer cam. Ideally you'd want a mix of both but that invloves a bit of rebuilding so I'd either use the ET as it is or swap the ET's head (inc cam) onto the F's bottom end if the high(er) compression ratio doesn't bother you. You will (probably) want to use the flywheel from the F as it has easier to use triggers than the ET's as the ET's used Motronic compared to the F's LH 2.4. this obviously isn't an issue if you +T the F, but worth bearing in mind if you swap blocks/engines.

Gearboxwise I'd stick with the M47 otherwise you need to get involved with sourcing a new propshaft as the M46 is longer
You are wrong. The B230ET come with a 9:1 compression ratio, the B230FT come with a 8.7:1 ratio, both have sodium filled exhaust valves, the ET come the the 531 head ("performance" head") and with the A cam, better the "T" used in FT with 530 head. IMO, use the ET with MS.
 
Many thanks, well my F currently has a 531 head fitted after a rebuild,
My ET is a '89 uk engine which I think im right in saying also had the thicker rods.
The F is currently on K-Jet, the ET is on the garage floor so not running anything ;) but was on Motronic with all the sensors still in place.
I have the prop shaft etc from the ET as well as the box and need to change the clutch on both. So as far as I know I have all the bits to use either engine and gearbox.
The only other things to be considered are the F was rebuilt to standard spec 45k ago although I am unsure of what cam is fitted. The ET has covered 89k with full service history.
The plan is to use MS with whatever combination I end up with, most likely using block mounted distributer as the head mount one on the ET wont clear the bulkhead.
The F gearbox (M47?) has covered 210k, whereas the ET one has 89k. Although both require a new clutch.
If any of those suggest any other uses or combinations please add your thoughts!
Thanks
Joe
 
Hi there,

Gearbox wise, I dont think it makes much difference which one you put in (many may argue otherwise).The reason I say it doesnt make much difference is ...

If you hoon it around like I do, the 'box will probably give up the ghost after a while. They are a doddle to swap in and out as long as you have a helper, and appropriate tools / jack / axle stands etc. The first (only time) I swapped out the trans it took me a fair while, but if you have somebody to hand whos done it before it wont take long at all. Seeing as you have two gearboxes, I wouldn't worry which one you put in. Once you have destroyed both the m47 and the m46 I think it will be time to go M90, which I what I will do when my second M46 grenades itself!

On the engine side of things, I would ditch any idea you have of going motronic. I like motronic (probably the only one on the board that has that oppinion!) as it has never given me any problems on my 23 year old 744 that sat unused in someones front garden for 9 years, before I bought it. Car runs lovely at a conservative 10psi.The reason you should ditch ti is mainly because you're missing half the loom and black boxes, and getting hold of all the right bits / wiring it up will be a pain in the ass.

What I would do in your boat would be to swap in the b230et and use the existing lh2.4 wiring loom in you car to run the engine. you will need to swap some of the sensors and stuff around, but its totaly doable - infact its exactly what Pete (chesh740r), Mike (suterman) and me have just done on my 244. Using the LH2.4 stuff will get you going, then you can do the megasquirt stuff at your convenience. You would have to get hold of some 2.3 turbo lh2.4 ecus tho.

Anyhow, Im a big lover of the b230et! Flame me at will, Im ready for ya ;-)
 
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Cheers for the reply.. sadly my cars currently running K-Jet so sticking with that is pretty much a no go on the ET or +T well I think i'll drop the ET in despite the hassle of changing it all with the DVLA, and use the M46 box as its got the sensor cut outs etc.
Im still chasing a few leads on the motronic but do now have Megasquirt waiting to be built. So guess the car will end up with that too!
 
Ok this is a bump for additional info..
Now have a megasquirt setup being built plan is to use MS and original block mounted dist.
Now should I still swap in the ET engine.. I will have to fit the block mounted dist. from my B230F as the head mount dist on the ET will foul the bulkhead.
I plan on keeping the M47 box in till it pops as the M46 needs a different prop which I dont have. Will I have to swap bell housings as the ET has the crank sensors mounted through the bellhousing and obviously the B230F doesn't or as I'm using MS can I just ditch them and keep the M47 belhousing.
Does using MS change anyones opinions on using the B230ET over the B230F +T option.
Thanks
Joe
 
do the f+t, it will have way better off boost response, depending on the year it may have the larger 13mm rods. since you are megasquirting it, keeping it well fueled wont be a problem if you are apt.

my 2 cents
 
The higher compression will produce a more drivable feel off boost. I would do the f+t and swap the cam in sense you said it has a 531 on it already. Do a good gasket match on the exhaust manifold and design a good flowing exhaust and you could have yourself a pretty fun DD.
 
Cheers, a +T would make life easier despite the extra work as there is less paperwork for the DVLA etc too.. I think i'll start looking into it closer.. am I liable to run into issues with running higher boost (14-15psi) with the higher compression from the +T is it worth sourcing a thicker head gasket?
I'll post the engine numbers up tomorrow as well and any further info you can give on them will be appreciated.
 
Just one thing; everyone's assumed the B230F will have the bigger rods, but what year is it? You mention K-Jet, and while I know some countries ran K-Jet way past when they probably should have ... do you know if your B230F has the bigger rods?

I suspect the answer is going to be to use a combo of both engines. I know you can block off the K-Jet holes in the head, for example, but that can't do good things for intake airflow?
 
Hey guys sorry for the delay but been away.. anyway im still undecided on what to do..
The B230ET is engine number 128914401554 (i think!)
The B230 is a B230E according to logbook, not an F as I said before. Engine number 49996001622 ( i think! lol)

Anyway just to reiterate the B230E is on about 50k after a refresh/rebuild, the B230ET is on 89k full history but has been sat.
So do I +T the B230E or swap in the B230ET complete?
Fuelling will be provided by Megasquirt, and the gearbox will be a M47 (I do have an M46 but need to find the correct prop for it)
Pro's/Con's from my point of view:
B230E +T..
+Less paperwork involved in swap with authorities
+I know the engine is good
-Need to drill oil return for turbo
-Need to swap cam/head and cam over from B230et
B230ET
+Made for a turbo
-Need to change bellhousing to use M47 box due to crank sensors
-Has been sat for a few months
-Need to get more paperwork cleared by autorities

So hopefully the engine numbers will allow you to give me some more details on suitability of either block. Both are UK engines and I believe both originally came from 700 series cars.

Im currently edging towards +T'ing the B230E block. possibly with the use of a thicker headgasket (if they are available) to help the compression a bit.
Not sure if I have said this but my aims are for approx 200-220hp from whatever combiation I end up with. Guessing this will mean about 14psi of boost??
Any additional thoughts based on the new info appreciated,
Joe
 
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