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Camshaft choice, high compression B23

spock345

spock345

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Location
Livermore, CA
Putting out a feeler for ideas. I'll be putting an NA B23 in my 144. A K or H cam is an easy way to go if I can find one. I have run a V15 before but the 144 doesn't have to be smogged so I think I can have a little more fun with it. Enem V16 maybe? I'm curious to hear other ideas.

I think the only limitation is that I've gotta be able to run pump gas, which probably limits compression more than anything.
 
The H cam is a stage 0 cam at the end of the day. Too many people have said that it's some massive cam that's dead down low and won't work in an automatic, and I believe that that comes from both having not enough CR and the trash exhaust port (and intake port throat I'm going to admit) on a 160/398/530. I've got an H in my automatic B230F with head work, and it idles as smooth as some M cam B230F cars I've driven, and makes great power everywhere. I think beyond 12mm of lift and 270 advertised duration with a stock small port head won't be helping, port velocity will suffer, and the exhaust won't be evacuated well. Esmth found that with a K, LH, and I'm assuming an untouched 530, that the maf will be reading rich because of the reversion, which shows already the limitations of the head, more-so than the cam imo. I'd like to try a Timos Motor 13.10 cam at some point. No expectation it'll behave well in my car, just more to find the limits of this head. https://turbobricks.com/index.php?threads/lh-maf-intake-reversion.370786/
 
OVERDRIVE said:
The H cam is a stage 0 cam at the end of the day. Too many people have said that it's some massive cam that's dead down low and won't work in an automatic, and I believe that that comes from both having not enough CR and the trash exhaust port (and intake port throat I'm going to admit) on a 160/398/530. I've got an H in my automatic B230F with head work, and it idles as smooth as some M cam B230F cars I've driven, and makes great power everywhere. I think beyond 12mm of lift and 270 advertised duration with a stock small port head won't be helping, port velocity will suffer, and the exhaust won't be evacuated well. Esmth found that with a K, LH, and I'm assuming an untouched 530, that the maf will be reading rich because of the reversion, which shows already the limitations of the head, more-so than the cam imo. I'd like to try a Timos Motor 13.10 cam at some point. No expectation it'll behave well in my car, just more to find the limits of this head. https://turbobricks.com/index.php?threads/lh-maf-intake-reversion.370786/
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I won't be running LH so reversion through a MAF is less of a concern for me. I've got a set of DCOEs, a microsquirt computer, and other pieces I can fiddle with.

My challenge at this point is finding an H or K cam. So I'm looking at what the swedish shops are currently churning out.
 
If you don't find the H or K. I'd want to try something like the V16. It would be OK with a V15 I don't think you are looking for OK. It will be a ripper with a V16 and it's still only stage 2.
 
dl242gt said:
If you don't find the H or K. I'd want to try something like the V16. It would be OK with a V15 I don't think you are looking for OK. It will be a ripper with a V16 and it's still only stage 2.
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Yep, I'm thinking stage 2 or 3 is going to be the sweet spot if I have to go to Europe for something.

I do think I found a lead on an H cam in the states.
 
The power band of the V16 is rated from 2500-6500 rpms. In my experience with the V15 that cam makes power for about 1k rpms above the power band which is 2k-6krpm. So it would be logical to think you can rip the V16 to 7500. Although for street I find 7k is enough rpms without breaking accessories.
 
I also recommend that kind of camshaft that it develops best power in 7200rpm range, and it is drivable at 3500-7500. Maybe v16 is it, or maybe you need a little bit radical cam, somethin about 13+mm lift and durations at 1mm something about 265/265...
 
Jussi Alanko said:
I also recommend that kind of camshaft that it develops best power in 7200rpm range, and it is drivable at 3500-7500. Maybe v16 is it, or maybe you need a little bit radical cam, somethin about 13+mm lift and durations at 1mm something about 265/265...
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I did just get my hands on an H grind camshaft for pretty cheap. I'm thinking of putting that in the engine and see how it is. Then go from there with changes.
 
I've run a high compression B23 (high 10.something with a little head shave) with an H cam as my daily for many years. Head studs. 24 lb injectors. Stahl header. 2.5 exhaust. LH 2.2+ezk. 541 computer. Nuke gear running about +2. Round tooth gear. Must run premium to keep it from knocking. Lopes at idle. Is almost as fast as my 242glt.
 
quillc said:
I've run a high compression B23 (high 10.something with a little head shave) with an H cam as my daily for many years. Head studs. 24 lb injectors. Stahl header. 2.5 exhaust. LH 2.2+ezk. 541 computer. Nuke gear running about +2. Round tooth gear. Must run premium to keep it from knocking. Lopes at idle. Is almost as fast as my 242glt.















For your NA B23 in the 144, the Enem V16 cam is a solid choice for performance without being overly aggressive. The IPD turbo cam offers a nice middle ground, while the A cam is a good option for higher RPM power. If you want something unique, consider a custom grind tailored to your specific setup and goals! I'm studying PhD, had lots of outstanding Philosophy essays but didn't know how to complete them quickly. My friend suggested an e-platform https://ukwritings.com/write-my-essay I'm satisfied with their service. UK writing offers writing services, where you can request essays or other written content. These services typically involve professional writers who assist with academic, business, or personal writing tasks.
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Thank you, I will keep it in mind.
 
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122power said:
How close or similar is the H to an rsi na?
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klr142

Thread 'RSI NA cam in action.'

Well, there's no real action yet, but with the many questions I thought I'd just start a thread. I'll eventually have dyno plots and drag times in here, but those don't really tell you anything. It's all in the words... :-p

Specs: 11.07mm lift, 252 deg. @ .050"(?) lift, and 110 LSA. Basically, doesn't sound like much on paper, but you can see that it's something special in the pictures.

My engine compartment has been attacked with winter rain and road trip dirt, I'm sorry it's so dirty... Anyway, comparison camshaft is a B cam...

If this is correct, 8° more duration on intake, 12° more on the exhaust @.050". But .9mm or so less lift on intake and .4mm less on the exhaust. 2° wider LSA too. Honestly I'm not impressed at the specs. Probably the largest drawback to redblock cams are how fast they can lift the valve. In the V8 world you can get cams with the duration of the T but .500" lift, well beyond any stock redblock cam. So if you're going to have long duration, but a bit less lift than a V, then you're really throwing away a lot.

I've got this theory that lift is the largest factor in a nicely performing redblock cam. This has its limitations regarding duration, you're just going to have to run more duration to get more lift. So to "mimic" a shorter duration cam to retain some low end power and drivability you can either tighten up the LSA (which generally makes the cam more low and midrange focused, drive a B and V in the same car back to back and you'll feel this), or you can advance the cam to get the intake valve closing point earlier. I have also felt that the wider LSA cams respond to advance better than the narrower LSA cams.
 
Funny how much attention the V has gotten recently.

I think KL Racing or KGTrimning also have a cam similar to this, with 11mm lift and a bunch of duration. I don't know if part of the design thought in these was that a stock head has pretty much flatlined at 0.450" so the only way to get more out of it is with valve open time, coupled with running with a stock valve spring. I wish I knew just how fast you can accelerate a valve on a 33mm bucket.
 
shoestring said:
Funny how much attention the V has gotten recently.

I think KL Racing or KGTrimning also have a cam similar to this, with 11mm lift and a bunch of duration. I don't know if part of the design thought in these was that a stock head has pretty much flatlined at 0.450" so the only way to get more out of it is with valve open time, coupled with running with a stock valve spring. I wish I knew just how fast you can accelerate a valve on a 33mm bucket.
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You can do it really fast when the base circle is small enough.

You should see the lobes on modern MX bikes. Looks like a rounded rectangle.
 
Dude the KG7 I had gotten many years ago looked like that. Made me wish I'd gotten a smaller one if the area under the curve was that much more. Sounded like a 2 stroke at idle.
 
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