refresh cooling system advice

[resunoiz]

Hi, our 1981 B19A has still ALL the entire cooling system original, except the (second) water pump changed last year because had a little leak.
Has 107'000km, so even if old of age, all parts have never been stressed: major wear is from time han from mileage.
No leak of any type: I've made 450km on the on a scorching day on the highway, mountain passes, winding roads in the middle of remote hills without having lost a single drop. I checked with a pencil mark on the reservoir the day of departure, and the morning after I returned, it hadn't moved a bit. I was perhaps too thorough with this test for a 50-year-old car...

Radiator was checked when changed water pump and my indy said: "this is the original one, has no leak. If you change it as PM you won't find another quality one like this today. Leave it there". I know for sure that was removed and flushed in the mid of the 90's for a water pump failure due to an incorrect coolant/mixture which led to some sludge, I don't remember exactly because I was a child, but it was necessary to empty everything. It was the last time my father took it to an official dealership. Thanks Volvo

I honestly confess that opening the hood and seeing everything just as it left the factory is still a great feeling today: if necessary, I would obviously change it, but if it were just a qualm, I would like it to stay there... tell me if I'm crazy/idiot or not.

For the rubber parts I think that preventivate maintenance is instead useful. What are the parts that are mandatory to mantain it in perfect shape, apart from the obvious 2 big rubber hoses?
I've found that schematics tha should be for our car but I don't have any PN for reference and I don't know if some parts are useless to change.



thanks in advance to who wants to help me

 

[Fa182]

No reason to change the radiator if it's still in condition and holds pressure.
Wouldn't hurt to check the rubber hoses for obvious cracks and brittleness and replace if they have never been changed.

Lots of stuff still around, depending where you are in the world.
GCP has all catalogs online with the part numbers.
Just google for them like "Volvo 1219990".
https://catalog.gcp.se/p/volvo-240/volvo-240-260-1979-1984/r/264/526-527/6420/1074268

 

[resunoiz]

thank you very much!!
rubbers seems ok, soft at touch, no visible cracks or hardened parts but...old.

I'm in Italy, our B19A was a version for Italy due to the tax for engines over 2 liters af the time.

I can viasually see 4 rubber hoses: 2 from reservoir, 2 from radiator but I honestly don't want to go "blind changes"

 

[Fa182]

That engine looks very nice and clean.
I wouldn't be too worried about it, given how everything looks and how the car behaved on your long drive.

 

[NLRegina]

I think the best course of action is to do a nice flush of the system, with distilled water maybe even run some thermocure for a little bit. When you drain everything out, inspect the hoses internally for any signs of failure. I pulled an upper hose off of a family members car during a coolant flush, and found the inside looked like an elephants skin, wrinkles and flaking apart. It looked fine on the outside though. If there is no flaking or disintegration inside, no cracking when you flex the rubber, those hoses should be fine to re use. I would make sure to check the heater core hoses more carefully, those are an often neglected item. Your engine bay looks very clean though, so I don't think you have to worry about oil leaks causing your rubber to become contaminated.

For coolant, I would just use the genuine volvo concentrate and dilute it 50 50 with a gallon of distilled water. Don't use tap or hose water, since the minerals inside will build up inside your cooling system and eat the aluminum.

The rubber and other parts volvo used seems to be a very high quality that lasts a long time. Yours seem to be no exception. Keep using high quality parts/fluids and you will have many more miles ahead of you.

 

[resunoiz]

I think the best course of action is to do a nice flush of the system, with distilled water maybe even run some thermocure for a little bit. When you drain everything out, inspect the hoses internally for any signs of failure. I pulled an upper hose off of a family members car during a coolant flush, and found the inside looked like an elephants skin, wrinkles and flaking apart. It looked fine on the outside though. If there is no flaking or disintegration inside, no cracking when you flex the rubber, those hoses should be fine to re use. I would make sure to check the heater core hoses more carefully, those are an often neglected item. Your engine bay looks very clean though, so I don't think you have to worry about oil leaks causing your rubber to become contaminated.

For coolant, I would just use the genuine volvo concentrate and dilute it 50 50 with a gallon of distilled water. Don't use tap or hose water, since the minerals inside will build up inside your cooling system and eat the aluminum.

The rubber and other parts volvo used seems to be a very high quality that lasts a long time. Yours seem to be no exception. Keep using high quality parts/fluids and you will have many more miles ahead of you.

coolant was flushed when changed water pump. I plan to do it again in a year (maybe in 2027) to be sure. What was the original color of the coolant? Volvo OE is the same today?

The heater core hoses are always the ones I fear more, in every car. Are easily reachable/visible in 244?

 

[Khrrck]

coolant was flushed when changed water pump. I plan to do it again in a year (maybe in 2027) to be sure. What was the original color of the coolant? Volvo OE is the same today?

Volvo OE formula is blue right now. As long as you don't mix coolants I have never heard of an issue caused by incorrect coolant formula. Personally I used generic green 50/50. Realistically I would recommend you stick with whatever you have been using since it seems to have been working with no issues.

The heater core hoses are always the ones I fear more, in every car. Are easily reachable/visible in 244?

The engine to firewall hoses are reachable and visible but actually replacing them without removing other stuff (intake manifold, etc) may be difficult depending on how long your arms are and how flexible you are.

They are at the back right corner of the block, around the bottom of the head. One is attached to the head, one is attached to an L-shaped pipe which goes around the other side of the engine to the back of the water pump. They both go to a pair of pipes fitted into the firewall. On the other side, if you take off the lower left side cover on the center console you should be able to see where they go from there towards the heater core and heater control valve.

 

[NLRegina]

coolant was flushed when changed water pump. I plan to do it again in a year (maybe in 2027) to be sure. What was the original color of the coolant? Volvo OE is the same today?

Just throwing it out there, where I am, genuine volvo coolant concentrate is about $25 and a gallon of distilled water is $1. Modern coolant has all kinds of additives to prevent corrosion in your cooling system, but they get depleted as they neutralize acids etc. It's very easy to flush on these cars, the reservoir is the highest point so the system bleeds itself (unless your thermostat was installed wrong).

All this is to say that the cost-benefit of a frequent high quality coolant flush is pretty significant. In these motors, a lot of head gasket failures seem to come from coolant passage corrosion in the head on cylinder 4.

 

[Red Amazon]

I come from the pre 1970 crowd, so 240's are not as familiar to me.

However, I know that on cooling systems, knowing the history of the car (ownership/maintenance) is important. -How often (historically) has the cooling system been flushed? Did the car ever have history of sitting in the garage (other) for over a year, undriven (with coolant idle)...?

A problem I have had with a B18 (like B20s?), is that when they sometimes sit for a few years, or just with age, crap can build up in the cooling system (scales), and create restrictricions for good flow- Is your radiator cool enough, but your engine hot? I ask because your radiator is noted as being good, and maybe the block needs a very good flush.

-I have had a problem where the radiator is cool (correct temperature), but the engine is hot. So, that is most likely poor flow in the head or the block (some restriction). I have used a high pressure hose to flush the block. Let me note, when flushing the direction of normal flow, all looked fine and clear, coming through the block. However, when I flushed the system the opposite direction of the normal flow, all sorts of crud, scales, and garbage came out of that block or cylinder head. -On the ground there were clumps of scales that had built up over the years. That resolved all cooling issues for that system. - Cool motor and cool radiator- or they were now the same temperature. Ten years later, I think it's time for that process again. (I do not drive this noted car during the winter). It gets an idle winter. And this is a cast iron block and head.

-It's just a suggestion to consider. -A high pressure reverse flow flush to the block and head (Radiator out of the equation).

 

[Mr. V]

I pulled the radiator from my '82 244 Turbo and took it to a radiator shop to have them pressure test and clean its coolant passages via dipping in the boil-out tank "just to be sure."

per AI:

"A radiator shop "boils out" a metal radiator by submerging it into a large, heated vat filled with a caustic alkaline chemical solution (the boil-out tank). The hot solution—heated near the boiling point—loosens, dissolves, and removes heavy rust, scale, grease, and old sediment trapped inside the core."

 

[resunoiz]

I come from the pre 1970 crowd, so 240's are not as familiar to me.

However, I know that on cooling systems, knowing the history of the car (ownership/maintenance) is important. -How often (historically) has the cooling system been flushed? Did the car ever have history of sitting in the garage (other) for over a year, undriven (with coolant idle)...?

A problem I have had with a B18 (like B20s?), is that when they sometimes sit for a few years, or just with age, crap can build up in the cooling system (scales), and create restrictricions for good flow- Is your radiator cool enough, but your engine hot? I ask because your radiator is noted as being good, and maybe the block needs a very good flush.

-I have had a problem where the radiator is cool (correct temperature), but the engine is hot. So, that is most likely poor flow in the head or the block (some restriction). I have used a high pressure hose to flush the block. Let me note, when flushing the direction of normal flow, all looked fine and clear, coming through the block. However, when I flushed the system the opposite direction of the normal flow, all sorts of crud, scales, and garbage came out of that block or cylinder head. -On the ground there were clumps of scales that had built up over the years. That resolved all cooling issues for that system. - Cool motor and cool radiator- or they were now the same temperature. Ten years later, I think it's time for that process again. (I do not drive this noted car during the winter). It gets an idle winter. And this is a cast iron block and head.

-It's just a suggestion to consider. -A high pressure reverse flow flush to the block and head (Radiator out of the equation).

Thanks.
The history of the car is well known, being acquired new by my father in 1980 and always driven by him.
The cooling flush as written was done when changed water pumps, last one 2 years ago with second water pump.
It has never been totally "sit", but driven for little distances, expecially the last 10/15 years. Maybe once a weekend, but for short trips. The coolant is clear and transparent, so was the water pumps that makes me think there is not that much "gunk" around but, who knows in the block?
"By hands" I don't feel any particular temp discrepancy: when hot, it cools with the fan, when normal, it sits just in the middle of the needle and the engine doesn't seem to have any temp differencies in the hoses (checked when investigating water pump and thermostat).

Just this weekend I went for another "short" trip in the mountains, 150km between 11am and 3pm: average outside temperature 38/40°C, very, very high external humidity. Even on the most challenging sections, I didn't notice any movement of the needle, except by half a millimeter because I was careful.

The flush is something I want to do as a PM to avoid issue but I don't know if being too "aggressive" will be the best way. I feel (maybe being wrong) that a high pressure hose if not specifically needed/not to solve an issue might be a little invasive

 

[NLRegina]

Thermocure will clear out more than a hose can, no need for high pressure. You can just drive it and let the water pump push everything around. The heat from the engine will speed up the reaction too and help it break down more rust/scale.

 

[Red Amazon]

- I am unfamiliar with "Thermocure". My note was in regards to the fact that the car is over 20 years old, and that's a good time for scales, or internal barnacles to attach inside- where you can't see them.

And, my note was in regards to if the radiator feels warm, and the engine is hot, I would be looking at an unseen restriction in the cooling lines of the block or head.

 

[Red Amazon]

... I am very familiar with Evaporust (same company). It looks to be a similar acting product, but for the cooling system. I have watched the videos and I still feel the same with my thoughts. But also that Theromocure looks to do a lot of what Evaporust does to metal.

In my experience with Evaporust, it will remove a lot of rust- most of it, but maybe not all of it. An issue I have with it is that it leaves a residue that takes a 2nd effort to remove. -Water and a brush, maybe another acidic product (?).

So if people feel strong about Thermocure, OK. But I think if I were going to use that in my car, I would follow up with a reverse flush blow out, as I noted before. What I have seen is that a lot of the internal rust desolves and sediments (somewhere). The product breaks fragements of the rust free. From there, you have small sand particles of rusty metal, maybe now swirling through your cooling system- Those were shown more than once with the online videos available.

A back fush with a compessor and water might blow the rest of that sediment out (?). -I still like to finish with a backflush, if possible.

I think that cooling systems are often neglected compared to simple things like an oil change.
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